Frequency-specific microcurrent is used not only for the treatment of pain and neurological symptoms, but also to enhance performance. The frequencies, as well as the modulation of the ‘microcurrent’ itself, offer a wide range of possibilities for both practitioners and patients.

In this episode, we feature an interview with a post-Covid-19 patient and the physiotherapist Christian Foulds-Saupe, a microcurrent therapist with over 15 years’ experience in therapy using microcurrent and specific frequencies. He was trained, amongst others, by Dr Caroly McMakin from the USA, who is regarded as a pioneer of FSM (Frequency-Specific Microcurrent Therapy) beyond the borders of the United States.

This podcast episode follows on from the previous parts:

“Post-Covid-19 Therapy Part 1/2 – Is microcurrent an option?”

“Post-Covid-19 Therapy Part 2/2 – Is microcurrent an option?”

In those episodes, Dr Voracek, a medical doctor, and Dr Thorsten Stüker, a physicist, were interviewed to shed light on the medical and biophysical background.

00:00:00
Interviewer: Right then. The device is recording. So I’ll say: a very good afternoon. I’d like to say good afternoon to Mr Bahnen and to Christian Foulds-Saupe. I’m in Stolberg today at the practice of physiotherapist Christian Foulds-Saupe, and I’d like to extend a very warm welcome to Mr Bahnen, a post-COVID patient. And we thought we’d try to connect with actual patients who can share a bit about the topic of microcurrent in relation to post-COVID treatment – that is, the long-term effects. Please bear with us if the audio quality is a little poor today, as we’re naturally sitting here wearing face masks, keeping a safe distance from one another, and using a microphone on the table. But I think everyone will understand, given the times we’re all going through at the moment.

00:00:59
Interviewer: Well then, Mr Bahnen, let’s just start with you straight away. Perhaps you could just give us a brief overview of your own experience, without going into too much detail just yet. I imagine you must have been asked 1,000 questions about COVID-19 over the last few months. We don’t want to go into that in too much detail just yet; instead, could you just briefly describe your experience from your own perspective?

00:01:24
Interviewee 1: I tested positive for COVID-19 in March this year. Whilst in self-isolation at home, I started having problems – including breathing difficulties – which I wasn’t even aware of myself. I denied it until my children, who could always tell from the sound of my voice on the phone, arranged for the emergency doctor to come to the house, who immediately called an ambulance. And then I was admitted to hospital at the very last minute, where Dr Winters’s first team at the Marienhospital in Aachen saved me from being admitted to the intensive care unit and from needing artificial respiration, by administering very high-flow oxygen therapy via a nasal cannula, starting at seven litres of oxygen per minute – in other words, a very intensive course of oxygen treatment.

00:02:18
Interviewee 1: I was then discharged after two weeks with lung function showing just over 90 per cent oxygen saturation. I was back at home having lost ten kilos. I spent two months at home almost entirely on my own, still hooked up to the oxygen tube day and night – I’d got used to it, you can cope with that quite well – and then, in the summer, I came here for treatment with Christian, where I’d been several times before, and where I’d already successfully experienced microcurrent therapy years ago on individual devices and for specific symptoms. We got talking, and the CT scan from June showed that there were still signs of ‘ground-glass opacities’ – remnants of the inflammation – but also scarring. That word had frightened me; you immediately think of pulmonary fibrosis, and of course you want to prevent it from developing rapidly in that direction. We got talking, and then he said: “Well, perhaps microcurrent therapy might be an option.”

00:03:32
Interviewee 1: And since you, Christian, know Carolyn McMakin personally, you recommended to me: “Why don’t you send her an email and ask if she knows anything?” She then replied to both of us and said: ‘I have a series of frequencies here. We’ve had positive results in individual cases, including with regard to lung tissue.’ And that was the starting point for me, when I said: ‘I’ll take that risk. I’ll give it a go.’ We then carried it out over a few sessions. The effect the first time was that I had to urinate for a very long time, which I’d never experienced in my life. I really hadn’t drunk that much. And I thought: “Well, it’s not entirely without effect.” I can’t say what effect it’s had on my lungs now.

00:04:27
Interviewer: Yes.

00:04:27
Interviewee 1: But in that case, there was a diagnosis. And then in September, after this whole range of treatments – the pulmonologist had also prescribed a course of high-dose cortisone – a new CT scan showed that the residual signs of pneumonia, with that ground-glass appearance, had disappeared, and that whilst the scarring was still present, it hadn’t spread or increased in extent.

00:05:02
Interviewer: Yes.

00:05:02
Interviewee 1: So, in that respect, it was a good result for me. And now, after a lot of training involving brisk walking, I can cope well with the challenges to my lung capacity, with an oxygen saturation level of between 93 and 95 per cent, I believe.

00:05:20
Interviewer: Very good.

00:05:20
Respondent 1: And I find microcurrent therapy very promising. So much so that I’d say: ‘You should definitely give it a go at least once.’ I’m glad I tried it here.

00:05:33
Interviewer: Yes. Christian, from your perspective as a therapist, what were Mr Bahnen’s treatments like for you? How did you experience them?

00:05:42
Respondent 2: Well, to begin with, it was exciting for me because it’s a new field.

00:05:44
Interviewer: Yes.

00:05:44
Respondent 2: We in physiotherapy do work with respiratory therapy, of course. But specifically using microenergy for post-COVID now – that’s new. Because it’s everywhere.

00:05:54
Interviewer: Yes.

00:05:54
Respondent 2: We’re sticking to the hygiene regulations here. We’ve been doing this since mid-March – even during the summer months – with masks and disinfection. And, of course, we’re also providing a high level of protection for patients in terms of safety measures. I’d noticed with Mr Bahnen that, at first, he was quite down mentally. That’s also very important. As a therapist, when you see that patients are really low and need to be built up first, so that there’s a possibility of doing something. We don’t know to what extent this helps; we have no experience in this area, and McMakin does, of course, have more experience than we do, so we’ve made use of that. And that has, of course, made a difference – perhaps there’s a placebo effect too – but it has, for a start, given them hope.

00:06:39
Interviewer: Yes.

00:06:40
Respondent 2: That you can try something. So rather than – as we’ve often said – ‘We don’t know, there’s nothing more we can do’, we simply set out on a new path, even if it’s uncharted territory. The experience with the toilet, too – that was really… It was only during the second treatment that I, as the therapist, didn’t drink quite as much, but it’s important to take in some fluid beforehand, partly to help transport the information through the body via micro-energy – but of course you know more about that.

00:07:08
Interviewer: Yes, absolutely. And also, as you say, it’s uncharted territory – that needs to be made very clear. Of course, it’s about looking at what gentle alternatives are available that can be used to manage the long-term effects or even to treat them. I mean, in the previous podcast with Dr Stüker and Dr Voracek, we were just talking about the topic of performance enhancement. That didn’t really touch on influencing tissue, influencing fibrosis or even influencing scar tissue in the lungs. I believe I also mentioned something in that podcast about arthrofibrosis, where we’ve been using microcurrent therapy – and have been doing so very, very successfully for several years now as part of a combination of therapies – and, in my view, I don’t see microcurrent therapy here as a stand-alone treatment either, but rather as a kind of complementary therapy, that is, one used as part of a combination of therapies – particularly in relation to what you just said about brisk walking: I’m no doctor, but I can well imagine that both, in the form of – let’s call it – training – because it is a form of training – go together exceptionally well, precisely to make the most of the regenerative effects. Perhaps it can also help clear residual inflammation from the tissue, and I can well imagine that. But of course we’re right at the very beginning here; it’s just that I don’t think we’re the only ones at the beginning: I believe this is the case for everyone in the world. With or without microcurrent, we simply need to gather experience here to see: how can we improve it? How can we refine it? How can we refine the frequency bands? How can we refine the application technique? These are all things we simply have to figure out and learn over time.

00:08:42
Interviewee 2: Yes. As therapists, we really should be working together – that is, sharing our experiences with individual patients, with specific situations, and with frequencies, for the benefit of the patient.

00:08:55
Interviewer: Yes, of course. I believe that sharing experiences is absolutely vital, because that’s the only way such a system can continue to become established. Even beyond Germany’s borders – so that we can say … Well, this year it’s been relatively difficult to engage in face-to-face interaction through seminars and training courses. Everyone’s ended up on Zoom, Zoom, Zoom with webinars. That’s all well and good, but personally I see it this way: microcurrent therapy, in particular, really thrives on practical work during training sessions, which simply wasn’t possible this year. I do, of course, hope that will be possible next year, but we’ve also held a few webinars and will continue to do so.

00:09:35
Interviewer: And if I may say so – I personally always try to look on the bright side of things – the positive aspect I’ve experienced during this time has been realising: ‘Right. It’s perfectly fine to look beyond your daily routine for a change and see what alternatives are out there. Because once you’ve run out of alternatives – as is the case now in a situation where you say you can’t hold seminars – just to give one example – then we simply have to run webinars, and as a company we naturally have to measure ourselves against that to see: Can I make this work? Are the customers, the users and so on satisfied with it? And I think there’s still a bit of work to be done in that area for many people. We, too, can – or I, in particular, can – continue to work on it and refine it. But well, you just have to make the best of it.

00:10:24
Respondent 2: Yes. Perhaps a podcast like this makes sense too: this interdisciplinary approach, where therapists reach out to doctors and doctors reach out to therapists: I’ve got an idea for how we can work together to help a patient regain a bit more quality of life. I think that’s a crucial factor in today’s world, precisely because we have to stay at home and look after ourselves, and if my quality of life isn’t up to scratch, that naturally has a massive impact on my mental health.

00:10:56
Interviewer: On mental health. Right, exactly. I think we’ll be facing quite different long-term consequences in the coming months and years. Because it’s still impossible to predict how long all these social restrictions will ultimately be maintained – and will have to be maintained.

00:11:12
Respondent 2: Yes.

00:11:13
Respondent 1: In listing the various therapeutic approaches I was able to use, I forgot the most important one: I’d been home from hospital for one day when I searched online: ‘Is there any respiratory therapy in Aachen?’ Because the exercises I’d been shown on discharge – a physical exercise to expand the lungs – weren’t enough for me, and I knew I didn’t have the discipline to do such an exercise regularly throughout the day. And I found an address – I rang them and spoke to a respiratory therapist who probably helped me in a special way, not just by carrying out limited respiratory therapy focused on my lungs and breathing, but by starting to work with me on my feet.

00:12:05
Interviewee 1: When I came out of hospital – I must say, I have type 2 diabetes, though a mild form – I had no contact with the floor via my feet, not even whilst I was in hospital, let alone at home. My sense of touch was impaired. That could be a vascular change, which might also be causally linked to COVID – I don’t know – but COVID does affect the blood vessels, after all. I was amazed that she didn’t start by saying to me, ‘Now breathe properly’ or something like that, but instead said: ‘Let’s start with the feet.’ And so she worked through my whole body, naturally with the aim of improving my breathing. Since then, I’ve known what my breathing space is. I wasn’t aware of my breathing space before. You breathe without thinking about it, of course. If you do think about it, you end up breathing incorrectly.

00:12:58
Respondent 1: That was a very, very important part of it, and I still do it to this day; this breathing therapy is a huge help to me. My pulmonologist knew this breathing therapist, and I haven’t heard a single disparaging remark about the other therapy from anyone involved. That’s in line with – which is why it occurred to me – what you’ve just been advocating: that one should embrace it.

00:13:24
Interviewer: Yes.

00:13:25
Respondent 1: So not so much as an alternative, but as a complementary therapy. I believe we’ll only manage to sort this whole thing out – given that there’s so much we don’t know, which is, after all, characteristic of COVID – if everyone works together, drawing on their own disciplines and perspectives. Ultimately, that’s what can benefit patients the most. That’s also what you were hinting at.

00:13:47
Respondent 2: Yes. I can only agree with that. Let’s also consider all other COVID patients, including those with autonomic imbalance, major organ involvement – in other words, the whole body – not always focusing solely on the lungs, but taking into account all these regulatory mechanisms throughout the body. And I believe this is also crucial for post-COVID treatments – that we don’t just think locally, but holistically across the whole body. And that’s why I can very, very well imagine that breathing and mindfulness exercises are also an essential part of treatment for patients.

00:14:18
Interviewer: Yes. That’s very interesting. Exactly. But that’s precisely what I was saying: learning the approach. And not just individually, but really as part of a community, through interaction as well. And that’s certainly an important aspect – particularly that interaction, things along the lines of: We have a user forum which was once actively used – it was something customers had asked for. But it keeps falling by the wayside. And you always have to remind people every now and then to interact a bit more in that forum. Yes, brilliant. Then, if you…

00:14:53
Respondent 2: Really, perhaps the key takeaway here is that we work in an interdisciplinary way. Not just medical professionals, but also reaching out to physicists and biophysicists. This interdisciplinary exchange needs to take place, including with colleagues in respiratory therapy and occupational therapy. Or, something else here in the hospital that’s also very exciting is a logotherapist, with whom we also collaborate. It’s all connected, isn’t it? Voice training, proper breathing. And that’s actually what I’d like to see for the future – that we look ahead in that direction and work together.

00:15:26
Interviewer: Yes.

00:15:29
Respondent 1: Speech therapy. What helped me during my brisk walks to strengthen and challenge my lung capacity was that I sang out loud whilst walking. At first, it bothered me that my voice had changed – no doubt because of the treatment. It was a bit hoarse. Through singing, I regained a different, fuller voice, and thank goodness that was possible. I didn’t go for walks in busy areas, but rather in places where I could sing loudly without disturbing anyone, and that helped me very, very much to experience that liberating sensation of breathing whilst singing. That’s still the case – even now, without a speech therapist by my side – but strengthening my vocal power was another aspect of it.

00:16:16
Respondent 2: Yes. Singing is also a form of mental training, after all. It releases endorphins and hormones, as is well known.

00:16:25
Respondent 1: I sang my favourite songs, of course.

00:16:29
Interviewer: Which is your favourite song?

00:16:32
Respondent 1: ‘Einmal möchte ich mit dir einen Atem teilen’ by Marianne Mendt.

00:16:37
Interviewer: How fitting!

00:16:37
Respondent 1: By a Viennese singer, and breath was the key word. And I then realised that breathing has become a big topic: there are books about breathing – new books, really thick books, non-fiction titles – which are appearing near the top of the bestseller lists. Breathing is – heaven knows why – a huge topic in these times of COVID.

00:17:01
Interviewer: Fascinating! I hadn’t really noticed that before, but that’s good. I’ll keep an eye out for it then.

00:17:04
Interviewee 1: The more colourful ones – if I may put it that way – where I wouldn’t have expected it: I happened to pick one up. They’re sometimes lying around in places where you have to wait. It had a multi-page feature article – not just on ‘society’ – about breathing. A breathing therapist had been quoted in it, and I thought: ‘She has a similar holistic approach to my therapist. That makes me happy!’

00:17:29
Interviewer: Very good.

00:17:29
Interviewee 2: Yes. Most relaxation techniques, in particular, are all based on breathing, whether it’s Tai Chi, Qigong or yoga – breathing is at the heart of it. Our breathing and the lung area are absolutely vital at the centre of the body.

00:17:46
Interviewer: That’s really fascinating. We ought to think about whether we might do a podcast on that.

00:17:49
Respondent 2: That would be one approach.

00:17:50
Interviewee 1: It’s the thing to do. I mean, if it’s ‘en vogue’ at the moment and people are picking up on things through the media: they know that breathing is key and that many people are on artificial ventilation. That’s a key point. It’s really weighing on my mind at the moment, because I can see beyond the figures and recognise the suffering that might lie behind them. I’m affected by this myself. I’m a survivor, someone who’s come through it.

00:18:17
Interviewer: Yes.

00:18:18
Respondent 1: As the doctors confirmed to me, it was a close call. And then you hear figures of 20,000, 30,000 and how many deaths a day, with a completely different context, as if it were just a statistic.

00:18:30
Interviewer: That’s right. Yes, of course. As someone directly affected, you naturally perceive the whole thing very differently.

00:18:33
Respondent 2: Yes. So that we don’t spend the night breathless…

00:18:39
Interviewer: Yes, that would be one way of putting it! Very nice. Brilliant! Then I’ll say: Mr Bahnen, thank you very, very much for taking the time to speak so openly about how you experienced it: I think that’s absolutely brilliant. Thank you very, very much!

00:18:51
Interviewee 1: You’re welcome.

00:18:52
Interviewer: And to you too, Christian, thank you very, very much for your time, and for arranging the venue and putting us in touch. I wish you all the best, Mr Bahnen, and hope things continue to go from strength to strength for you. I’m keeping my fingers crossed for you. I wish you every success too, Christian, so that you can refine your treatment approach with patients of this kind – post-COVID patients. We’ll be working on that together as well. It’s not just you on your own, after all.

00:19:19
Interviewee 2: Yes, yes.

00:19:20
Interviewer: Thank you very much. And I’d like to say: it’s now 23 December, and tomorrow is Christmas Eve. I certainly won’t be publishing the podcast before Christmas. Tomorrow, in fact, there’ll be a podcast – the big end-of-year review. I recorded that yesterday; it’ll also be released as a YouTube video, and the audio track will then be published as a podcast. But it’ll be out very, very soon, and so I’d like to say: thank you very much. I wish you a blessed and merry Christmas, and an even better – and above all, a much, much healthier – 2021, so that we can see a ray of hope in this area once again.

00:20:04
Interviewee 1: Thank you, likewise!

00:20:05
Interviewee 2: Yes, I think 2021 will definitely be better than 2020.

00:20:09
Interviewer: It really can only get better!

00:20:11
Respondent 2: Well, yes, I think so too. It can only get better.

00:20:13
Interviewer: OK. Thank you very much!

00:20:15
Respondent 1: Thank you, Patrick.

00:20:16
Interviewer: That was fun!

00:20:17
Respondent 2: Likewise!

00:20:22
Respondent 1: That I…